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I'll look around for any weird issues, and the idle/off idle at sea level is a bit iffy, but the power while throttle is mashed is GREAT. I can't imagine it running this good at the sea floor at 10k rpms, but having an intake leak that makes it run so rich it fouls the plugs in 5 minutes at 5000ft elevation? I could see if it's trying to run a 3000ft elevation tune at 5000ft, that would be awful. Maybe the Alba tune is every 500ft or 1000ft?

I did find something weird, and I'll try to get a picture of it when I can get back to the machine this weekend, but the middle MAP sensor tube on the 3 bar sensor connecting to the manifold is slightly backed off the fitting, BUT there is a 90 degree angle fitting, and it wont push on any further. No idea why they designed it that way, it seems really dumb It doesn't show it in the microfiche, but it's on the engine-side of tube 11: 2021 Yamaha YXZ1000R SS SE CAL (YXZ10YCCMW) Throttle Body Assy 1 | Babbitts Yamaha Partshouse

Yea, that's what I thought the point of a MAP sensor is. I know they are inferior to MAF, but they should basically auto correct for less air by pulling fuel? I also noticed there are two identical MAP sensors on the base non-turbo install, so I assume the system retained the 1bar map sensor for finer details on the MAP? Maybe the GYTR sucks at reading that and MAPs, and the Alba tune corrects for that?

I did just get a concerning email response from Alba just now about their tune and elevation:
Would be best to call in and get with Fernando. I do know the YXZ doesn't have an oxygen sensor to change between altitudes; the ECU is not the smartest.
Anxiously awaiting the results from your future call with Fernando…
 

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Definitely check your Map sensor connectivity or other install related potential quirks, it is absolutely critical that this is getting a proper reading or all is toast.

Map sensor (Speed Density) IMO is just as good as MAF, as long as the ECU is mapped well for all of the hardware and Density Altitude, especially if it has an O2 feedback (closed loop). The good thing about MAF is that it can better adapt to other mods, such as exhaust systems/etc., as the MAF directly reads the air volume coming into to the engine so has a pretty good idea of how to fuel it, plus the O2 sensor feedback (closed loop) also makes it very compliant. This is where the YXZ ECU becomes the machines achilles heal, as it needs retuned for any significant changes you make outside of the kits original design, and to top it all off it has no O2 sensor so it is an open loop ECU. All you have is a couple fueling tables in the ECU and a MAP sensor, that is it, so if one or the other is bum the machine will be lucky to even limp.

I can see why they'd say the YXZ ECU "is not the smartest" and for these reasons it seems like a very bad idea to not plan a WBO2 as part of your turbo install IMO.
Great explanation. Actually makes sense.
Does that mean that there is no sensor anywhere else that adjusts for altitude?
Was hoping for more of an install, plug and play situation….
 

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Enjoying the “back and forth” between you two. Seriously think it’s good discussion.
Haven’t started my install yet but when I went down to Alba for my flash, I brought my map sensor with me. Alba was able to test it for operation and compatibility.
Hey Rob, what do you know about air filter access when installing V1 on a 2021? Looks like access is way better on the V2…. correct?
 

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Firstly any idea why your smoke test ended up with smoke out your exhaust (with the air injection deleted)? It should stop at the intake or exhaust valve inside the chamber, unless you just happen to catch a smidge of camshaft overlap (seems unlikely).

Mostly from this thread I hope this doesn't happen to me. Last year we drove about 14 hours to get to the mountains for a ride weekend and rode trail systems up to ~10k feet. All of that for this immediate off the trailer outcome would be terrible trip. My completely stock machine was a complete slug, especially ran like complete crap initially but seemed like it "adjusted" to a tolerable state, and I was able to make it mostly work out but was an absolute chore powering up some of the climbs. Once I get this GYTR Turbo kit installed I have no way to test it otherwise as there is no where close to get any elevation around me. That said if you ever figure anything out please circle back, I'll keep the spare parts around just in case.
EXACTLY! This thread got me worried as well.

BUT, after reading through and following along, I really have to believe that what happened is a mechanical issue somewhere. You said it perfectly in your post #38 when you mention something going awry.

I also think that Albas tune allows better tuning because they don’t have to tune around parameters dictated by CARB. Yamaha does and is also working around a restrictive catalytic exhaust.

So, I will go forward with eyes wide open and install my kit at the end of this month and hope for the best. The majority are not having issues.

And I sincerely hope Spotsjd gets this figured out and reports his findings. It ultimately helps out everyone here.
 

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Just bumped into this old thread, any chance your plenum too is partially attached?
Good research! I hope there is something to this. BTW, I’ve seen more than once that the Weller intake boots and support are a good thing. May preemptively do this mod.
 

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Would be nice to hear quite a few 3rd parties with the GYTR Turbo kit confirm they are able to go to whatever elevations they want and still have a fine running machine.
So help me out here.
If the stock sensors feed info to the ECM and everything works well before a turbo is installed, what is it about a turbo that changes things?
I mean, I get the obvious. More fuel to mix with charged air and such but isn’t that all done in tuning the ECM? Remapping A/F mixtures for a turbo application.
If the map sensor can provide info to a non turbo unit and it performs well at sea level as well as 6k ft, what changes when you add a turbo? There are a thousand non turbo units that go from sea level to the mountains on a regular basis without issue.

Agreed, It would be nice for those who are problem free turbo owners to chime in.
But usually, happy customers don’t chime in. Those with problems do. So I’m guessing most are happy?
Let us know owners!
 

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While I think most don't have problems, I also think most don't change elevation much. I rode everything I owned between 0ft and 500ft for 15 years until about 5 years ago. I'd be curious of the number of Y owners that run more than 500ft of elevation difference, let alone gytr owners.

The only sensor changed on the gytr kit is the 1 bar to 3 bar to detect the boost. It replaces a 1 bar sensor. What I don't have a clear answer on is, is the second, front map sensor on the engine purely for atmosphere? And, is it possible to ruin/nullify the atmospheric reading with a quick key on to start time? And why would an atmospheric map sensor be tied into the intake? Pure lazyness and cheapness? Was it used to double check the first map sensor on the stock Y while running and the gytr moves to a single map solution? Making that atmosphere alone?

If only the yxz community was a bit more like the civic community.
Oh, that’s right, the map sensor is different on the turbo kit.
I have read some threads where Albanate mentions the GAP 3 bar which Yamaha was using. Had some issues with it….?
 

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That would make sense. The thing looks like it's built to flow, not built to muffle lol.

It would also make sense their performance tune would drop the fan on-times too. If even one of your read values is correct, then it's still 5 degrees higher than whatever tune is on my ECU.

I might need to try and call them tomorrow, though I don't see any information about their shop online? Anyone have a phone number? Maybe a Yamaha dealer will give me some info, but I have a feeling prying anything from their cold, dead hands without a diagnostics fee will be impossible.
Here you go….. Dasa Contact

Exhaust/Manufacturing:
9251 Orco Parkway
Unit A
Jurupa Valley, CA 92509

Engine Work:
515 Airport Rd
Salisbury, NC 28147

P: (704) 431-6253

Exhaust/Orders/PWC
[email protected]

Engine/Service Work
[email protected]
 

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Note I said the GYTR temp could be flawed, it’s prob low or high, not both. FTecu is supposed to be correcting all the definitions on the GYTR ECU someday, but the 194 is prob a valid datapoint (and cooler than the norm either way).

Send me the ECU, I’ll read it and see if the fuel tables are different. That sure would be something if GYTR had a tune for full exhaust and accidentally programmed this ecu that way.

I wonder if DASA does these programs? They definitely helped design the kits hardware. Maybe that’s what the DA stands for on all the hand scribes on the GYTR ECUs.
You know when I bought that used GYTR kit that Yamaha couldn’t get to work right, I just kept thinking ECU….
I’m really thinking the Alba tune of my stock ECU is going to be the key.

And Fernando at Alba really reinforced how much better it all worked with an open pipe.
They sell Trinity but he clearly stated that any open pipe would work well with their tune.
Also that the noise would be substantially reduced due to the turbo.
 

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So in a panic, as to not ruin another trip, I've ordered 1-day from Alba a stage 2 ECU, a trinity slip-on, and another MAP sensor(they sell them for 130, which is a deal since I cant seem to even find that specific one online).

If this doesn't get my AFRs reasonable, well, I wanted a tuna and a can anyway, and just can't blow 4500+ right now in my life on the Motec.

Yamaha in my neighborhood wants $220 to plug in their diagnostic tool, and then probably 220 an hour(assuming, didn't ask, RIP inflation) if they can't figure it out after that. If it's the ECU they would probably be chasing their tails for hours. I have zero confidence in dealerships anyway, unless under warranty.

I might send that ECU to you Rob, but I'm wondering since I want a TCU flash anyway and I'm probably going to stick with stock ECUs, if I shouldn't pick up my own FTECU and just pull it myself and we can share the files. I'll probably do that if you ever get any solutions to your current FT issues

Like you said, things will need to be custom tuned if we start throwing pod filters and bigger downpipes on these things, which I'd probably do.
VERY interested to see what this does for you. Hoping for the best…….
 

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Alright... here we go. So, I would like to start by stating what Yamaha GYT-R site claims for HP gains on this kit. "Up to a 60% increase in power overall 1" with that being said.

Stock baseline: 81
GYT-R kit as delivered with stock muffler tip: 105.1rwhp/74.6 ft/lbs tq, and 12.03:1AFR
GYT-R kit with Alba SBD tip installed: 119.5rwhp/76.3 ft/lbs tq, and 12.64:1 AFR (getting scary)
GYT-R kit with Alba Muffler installed: 116.2rwhp/78.2 ft/lbs tq, and 12.7:1 AFR (EEKKK!!)
GYT-R kit with Alba Muffler and open foam air filter: 129.7rwhp/82.7 ft/lbs tq, and 12.85:1 AFR (Yikes!)

At that point I had to start building my own ecu tune to get it back to a safe AFR value. Safety is key here...I altered the tables to increase fueling under boost and went as low as 11.5:1 looking at what it liked best. Here is where I ended up settling in at...

124.5 RWHP
82.0 RW Ft/lbs TQ
12.10:1 AFR
All runs showed about the same boost of 7psi.

I know there is more here if we turn the boost up, but I will add that I am seeing about 93% injector duty cycle at the higher RPM's so injectors will be recommended to go past the delivered boost level.

Nate
Alba Racing
Not any authority on afr numbers but does anything from this old GYT-R thread from Nate at Alba shed light on this afr question?
 

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Very confused on the ITB+Lopey Cam= overly rich idle being normal talk.
Yamaha cp3 is the basic architecture for this engine. Same used in many other applications including 900cc sport bikes and adventure bikes like the Tracer.
Cross plane engine with 3 cylinders will cause some overlap which effects fueling. Not any issue, just nature if the beast.
BTW, my Tracer with CP3 engine has an 02 sensor from the factory.
Interesting stuff about the basics of this engine;
 

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Getting a few AFRs from the stock air-inject deleted setup would be interesting. I wonder if the GYTR turbo is CARB compliant, or, "CARB Compliant".
I think that this is an issue with the GTYR turbo.
Being from CA and understanding how it all works here, I think that Yamaha MAY have failed us. This kit is not engineered by the factory (correct me if I’m wrong). Yamaha needs a kit to keep up with the turbo (performance) crowd but have not engineered a factory turn key turbo model such as Polaris of Can Am has. I really thought that the V2 variant would lead to a factory turbo model, but that doesn’t look like it’s in the cards…They have succeeded in getting an outsourced GYTR turbo kit CARB approved but at what cost? It is not a complete package. There are potential glitches.
Tuners like Alba and others who are not constrained by CARB have a better chance at making it work.
But Yamaha has not and probably will not every make a YXZ that has a properly tuned CARB compliant engine with all the sensors and features that you guys are hoping for.
So, as you say, if we want all tuning features you guys mention, we’ll probably have to do it in the aftermarket.
That being said, there are plenty of guys out there running the GYTR turbos with stock and aftermarket tunes, with stock and open pipes that are quite pleased.
So that begs the question of why a handful are having these issues? I don’t know why…
What do you guys think?
 

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@spottsjd after everything and what seems to be dead ends (or very slow ends anyway), I'm thinking I've got myself talked into just doing the Dynojet Power Commander 6 (not 5 anymore apparently) and the Autotune. Once I add my custom exhaust I may have Alba tune the ECU, but as they will not get it right (the exhaust I have is much more free flowing than the typical slip-on setup) I'll still have the Autotune to help correct it. Or I may just run the GYTR ECU base file with Autotune over the top initially, not sure on that yet. The good news is that this SHOULD always help keep fueling under control, regardless of elevation (etc); all else going right anyway.

While this is not the way I'd like to see this go and certainly not the ultimate in fail safes, it is at least a means to an end.
Move forward. You’ll get what you need with the solutions you’ve mentioned.
FTecu seems to be a bit of a letdown…..So far
 

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New results with the capped off Air Injection. Still a completely stock, naturally aspirated, 2019 SS.

Footnotes:
83*F Ambients
500' Elevation
New AEM WBO2
Cold start is around 12.8 for a moment and it doesn't take too long before it is right around 13.0. Shortly thereafter (just a bit of heat in it) and moves towards 13.2, and it is very stable from that point onward to fan cycling.
So it stays in the 13.0 range (+/-0.2AFR) from cold start all the way to radiator fan cycling.
Throttle stabs push towards the 12.xx range.
I did NOT drive to get consistent WOT fueling.

Summary: I see no reason why they'd tuned the GYTR setup to idle so much richer than that. FWIW my idle is pretty stable around 1,500rpm.
So with AIR in place it would read leaner, right?
 

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The air-injection causing such a lean exhaust may be what the CAT needs to get the right temp. to do its job.
Agree to the possibility. I’ve said it previously that Yam has emissions and other factors to deal with in these vehicles. I really have to respect the engineers at Yamaha that there is a method to their madness 😉😁. I also respect the efforts you guys are putting into making something better once the whole “regulations” thing goes out the window. I’ve started my turbo install and am thinking that I should install a bung in the exhaust for a sensor (even if I don’t need it now). Where should I locate it in the exhaust pipe?
 
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